Robotic voices 3300 ICP

[jtrogdon]

Hello all,

I have a problem that I hoping to get some opinions on.  Here's my setup.  I have two plants, each with the same type of Time Warner cable modem.  I have two Mitel 3300 ICP devices, one at each plant, that are plugged straight into the cable modem with their own static IP address.  One modem is configured with 10x1 speed and the other is configured as a 35x5 (wideband) speed.  We have had major problems with people the end that uses the 35x5 connection hearing the other plant with robotic voices.  If you wait long enough during the conversation the voices will return back to normal.  The people who installed these Mitel say they have never heard of this before.  We are NOT using IP phones.  We are using the Mitel Superset 4025 handsets.  The Mitel system contains 4 SHARC 21363 DSP and two DUAL FIM 820MM.  I have listed below a subset of the maintenance logs which looks like a Time Warner issue with the network but their technicians have checked both sites and everything is in spec with no errors.  Any ideas on what could be causing these robotic voices?

MAINTENANCE LOG:

1142   Info   2011/Aug/31   11:35:26   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 40 sec JB over=42 under=121  maxJtr=1185msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
1141   Info   2011/Aug/31   11:23:48   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 151 sec JB over=43 under=129  maxJtr=1205msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
1129   Info   2011/Aug/31   11:21:03   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 14 sec JB over=45 under=122  maxJtr=1219msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
1128   Info   2011/Aug/31   11:20:48   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 7 sec JB over=47 under=124  maxJtr=1242msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
1116   Info   2011/Aug/31   10:52:18   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 210 sec JB over=48 under=129  maxJtr=1251msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
1107   Info   2011/Aug/31   10:47:09   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 130 sec JB over=46 under=128  maxJtr=1229msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
1102   Info   2011/Aug/31   10:37:12   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 792 sec JB over=90 under=264  maxJtr=1225msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 2
1086   Info   2011/Aug/31   10:12:45   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 378 sec JB over=183 under=409  maxJtr=1245msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 4
1076   Info   2011/Aug/31   9:58:42   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 163 sec JB over=46 under=125  maxJtr=1227msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
1073   Info   2011/Aug/31   9:48:05   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 353 sec JB over=58 under=223  maxJtr=1199msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 2
1070   Info   2011/Aug/31   9:39:23   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 710 sec JB over=47 under=168  maxJtr=1237msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
1054   Info   2011/Aug/31   9:02:52   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 269 sec JB over=114 under=388  maxJtr=1233msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 3
1053   Info   2011/Aug/31   9:00:51   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 226 sec JB over=116 under=382  maxJtr=1233msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 3
1037   Info   2011/Aug/31   8:35:10   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 83 sec JB over=45 under=125  maxJtr=1215msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
1034   Info   2011/Aug/31   8:23:49   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 270 sec JB over=91 under=256  maxJtr=1225msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 2
1032   Info   2011/Aug/31   8:09:25   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 37 sec JB over=43 under=121  maxJtr=1203msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
886   Info   2011/Aug/30   16:58:19   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 325 sec JB over=107 under=314  maxJtr=1128msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 3
885   Info   2011/Aug/30   16:48:04   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 61 sec JB over=35 under=112  maxJtr=1113msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
884   Info   2011/Aug/30   16:47:12   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 1159 sec JB over=279 under=776  maxJtr=1146msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 8
877   Info   2011/Aug/30   16:15:34   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 265 sec JB over=70 under=230  maxJtr=1126msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 2
874   Info   2011/Aug/30   15:54:54   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 223 sec JB over=68 under=223  maxJtr=1120msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 2
871   Info   2011/Aug/30   15:49:41   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 7 sec JB over=32 under=108  maxJtr=1088msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
861   Info   2011/Aug/30   15:01:16   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 46 sec JB over=34 under=111  maxJtr=1100msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
854   Info   2011/Aug/30   14:41:42   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 281 sec JB over=96 under=250  maxJtr=1102msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 3
848   Info   2011/Aug/30   14:32:11   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 26 sec JB over=35 under=112  maxJtr=1117msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
845   Info   2011/Aug/30   14:26:37   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 59 sec JB over=31 under=108  maxJtr=1080msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 1
843   Info   2011/Aug/30   14:22:55   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 637 sec JB over=150 under=379  maxJtr=1137msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 4
841   Info   2011/Aug/30   14:02:21   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 244 sec JB over=67 under=153  maxJtr=1109msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 2
834   Info   2011/Aug/30   13:10:17   E2tSp   IP Network Congestion AlertJitter from phone xx.xx.xx.xx > 300msCall duration 149 sec JB over=67 under=202  maxJtr=1101msnumber of Pkts with J > 200ms = 2

Thanks for any help or suggestions you can give me!

[brantn]

Not sure of robotic voices but looking at a subset of maintenance logs posted you have a lot of network jitter which could easily create call quality issues.

[jtrogdon]

Considering all the jitter I'm seeing in the logs,  is there a setting on the 3300 ICP that helps buffer or control jitter?

[brantn]

Not really this is simply due to connection and network reliability. So the 3300s are public facing is that what I understood? Directly into a cable modem?

[jtrogdon]

That's correct, they are attached directly to one of the cable modem jacks.  We did have the Mitels inside our network but removed them to the outside because of these problems.  It looks like being inside our network and traveling up our VPN wasn't the problem with the garbled voices.

Since this is a Time Warner internet connection and if they keep saying they see no errors on their network, is there any way I can compensate for these type of network fluctuations?  We are using the G.711 codec.  Would it be better to use the G.729 codec which has smaller packet size? 

[brantn]

I would put it back in a network config instead of direct on the WAN you could compress both ends of the IP trunks which might help a little. This would force G729 between sites. The issue that you got to deal with on a normal lan is network congestion and not quaranteed bandwidth also no QOS. With dedicated circuits you can do some QOS depending on carrier.

[jtrogdon]

I was told that in order to use G.729 on our Mitel 3300 ICP we would need a new board installed and compression licenses.  I have mentioned this to our phone equipment provider and they are hesitant about using G.729 because they have never had to use it before on any of their installations. 

Do you know of anyway I could give my Maintenance Logs to Mitel directly or do you always have to go through a certified partner?  I starting to lose faith in my local phone equipment provider.  Thanks for any advice!

[ralph]

You won't be able to upload your logs directly to Mitel tech support.  They work through their VARS.
If you use Mitel Direct, think of them as just another VAR.

G729 compression will produce smaller packets that need to transverse your wan.
This will also help in packet serialization - meaning it takes time for packet to queue up to be sent over the WAN.  Other - non VoIP - packets also queue up so there can be a greater jitter between the packet delivery.   So G.729 will help some.

G729 is common to use across WANS.   It does require compression licenses and a DSP board to handle it.
Bear in mind, it will break faxes and modems but with the issues you're already having I suspect you are not using them across the wan.

Ralph

[jtrogdon]

Thanks for the info.  You are correct. We are not using faxes or modems across the WAN.  I found out that Time Warner, the provider of our Internet connection and the connection we are using between plants, installed a brand new tap right at one of the poles at my other location.  So I'm wondering if that area hadn't been upgraded to handle business-like traffic.  I guess we'll see.  Thanks!

[jtrogdon]

Just an update in case this helps anyone.  We had Time Warner replace our cable modems, for the third time, from a Motorola 6580 to a Ubee modem.  Ever since then I've had no reports of the garbled/robotic voices. 

[bobcheese]

compression licenses and DSP only required if compressing a TDM signal. If IP-IP internal IP set on system 1 to IP set on system 2 then no compression licenses required. Worth enabling as a test.

[jtrogdon]

compression licenses and DSP only required if compressing a TDM signal. If IP-IP internal IP set on system 1 to IP set on system 2 then no compression licenses required. Worth enabling as a test.

I'm not quite sure I understand what you are saying.  Our phones are the Mitel Superset 4025 and they are NOT IP phones.  We have two Mitel 3300 systems, one at each plant, that communicate over the Internet through our VPN using Time Warner's cable.  I would assume they are using a TDM signal to transfer packets between the two Mitels. 

[bobcheese]

4025's are tdm phones therefore compression licenses and dsp would be required

[Kurt]

Have you seen any more Network Congestion entries in the Maintenance logs on either 3300 since you replaced the modem and stop receiving reports of the issue?

[pakman]

Hello jtrogdon,

I to am having issues with jitter and voice quality at one of our locations with Time Warner. How did you go about getting them to swap out the equipment? I've had them run several test and they keep telling me it's fine but some months ago they finally admitted to having a circuit issue within a x number of blocks, I beleive some of our issues are still related to this probelm.

Thanks,