Planning for 5000 install

[WallIT]

Hi,

I am planning for a Mitel 5000 installation for a firm of about 50 staff. The company we are buying from has offered little help on the networking side so I need to plan, implement and test this myself.

We use Netgear FS724TP switches for the computers and servers. These are PoE switches so I plan to have the IP phones on the same switch port as the PC's. We currently have a flat network with no VLANs. I've read as many forums, white papers and topics as I can find and I believe I understand what needs to be done to separate the voice and data traffic.

- I need two VLANS
- Two subnets (using the same subnet mask)
- I need to route between these networks using our gateway (Sonicwall router)

I thought I understood the changes I needed to make to DHCP, but after reading some comments from Chakara I'm now not so sure.

Lets assume network 192.168.40.x is for Pc's (call it VLAN40) and 192.168.50.x for phones (call it VLAN50). I thought the phones would boot up on the default vlan (VLAN40), read the options from DHCP, get their new VLAN, reboot again onto VLAN50, then get an IP address from 192.168.50.x range

We have 1 DHCP server.

The comments from Chakara suggest the DHCP server doesn't need access to VLAN50 - my question then is how to the phones get an IP address in the .50 range?

Please correct my assumptions and any mistakes above

Thanks in advance.

PS: I'm bound to have quite a few questions over the coming weeks!

[v2win]

You will need a DHCP helper address in you VLAN 50 pointing to your DHCP server in VLAN 40

[WallIT]

Thanks. The Sonicwall router does support DHCP helper so I can configure that.

Other questions...

1a. Does the DHCP server (currently single-NIC in .40) need another NIC in .50 range?
1b. If so, then that conflicts with the advice that Chakara was giving about not putting DHCP server in VLAN50 - or am I missing something.
2. How do the phones know which VLAN they should be in? Presume they tag packets with a VLAN? But to get the correct VLAN ID the DHCP server would need to know whether the device is a phone or PC.
3. We currently have 1 LAN interface on the Sonicwall router (in .40 range). I presume I need to use another LAN interface for the .50 range? Or can I trunk the VLAN's to get a 'router on a stick'? What's the best method? (there are spare interfaces on the router)

Many thanks.

[v2win]

The DHCP helper is programmed in the data switch.

[WallIT]

Not sure about that. The switches are Netgear FS724TP - I've searched the PDF manual and there is no sign of DHCP helper.

Our Sonicwall router (which can act as a DHCP server, although this is disabled - we use a Windows DHCP server) has a feature called "IP Helper". The submenu in this gives options for forwarding DHCP requests between networks.

Is this what you mean by 'DHCP helper'?

Thanks.

[v2win]

Sorry I wasnt thinking clearly when I posted that. I am going to assume that your switches are layer 2 only and DHCP is a layer 3 protocol.

So let me try that again

1a. Does the DHCP server (currently single-NIC in .40) need another NIC in .50 range? Its not pretty but it will work.


1b. If so, then that conflicts with the advice that Chakara was giving about not putting DHCP server in VLAN50 - or am I missing something. DHCP relay is probably the best way to do this


2. How do the phones know which VLAN they should be in? Presume they tag packets with a VLAN? But to get the correct VLAN ID the DHCP server would need to know whether the device is a phone or PC. The phone boots untagged gets the vlan options and resets with tagged packets the data vlan in untagged the voice vlan would be tagged on the PC/Phone ports


3. We currently have 1 LAN interface on the Sonicwall router (in .40 range). I presume I need to use another LAN interface for the .50 range? Or can I trunk the VLAN's to get a 'router on a stick'? What's the best method? (there are spare interfaces on the router) Either way will work I think its a matter of preference

[WallIT]

Ok, thanks for clearing that up.

So, I'll create a new .50 scope on the DHCP (leave it single-nic). I'll then setup a DHCP relay on the router to forward requests to that server.

If a phone boots untagged how does DHCP know to identify it as a phone and therefore give it the necessary VLAN ID?

Many thanks again.

[v2win]

I am not sure on the 5000 but in the 3300 you add options to your DHCP server so the phones know to tag the packets.

If your vendor cant help with this or no one else chimes in I will see if I can find a 5000 manual.

[WallIT]

Thanks.

Possibly an easier option is to use the 5000 as a DHCP server for the .50 range - is that possible?

[Chakara]

  Not sure - the the 3300 yes.  But - you still need to tell the phone which vlan to be on.  It works like this:

 - Phone boots and get's DHCP on data vlan
 - Phone see DHCP option from data vlan that tells it what VLAN it should be on (voice 50)
 - Phone releases data IP, starts tagging packets on voice (50) vlan and requests and gets new address on voice vlan.
 - Phone passes original data vlan to the PC connected.

Another option is to use LLDP to tell the phone what VLAN to be on.

-Chak

[v2win]

So I found the manual for setting up the IP phones on the 5000. It looks like the 53XX series use the same options as the 3300 and the 86XX series use a different method.

For the 53XX series phones here is a snippet from the book

[Curtis-at-Travis]

Option 43 will do all of these various options, but in one string of information.

[nevik8]

DHCP options 125 or 128, 129, 130, 132, 133. Sonicwall should have IP Helper configuration under Network/IP Helper. Create the sub interfaces and connect the Parent interface to layer 2 switch (VLAN Trunk). Create IP Helper to forward from VLAN interface to the DHCP server IP. Option 125 is a string: id:ipphone.mitel.com;sw_tftp=<Server IP address>;call_srv=<Server IP address>;vlan=<VLAN ID>;l2p=1;mode=minet . Option 128: <Server IP address>,  Option 129: <Server IP address>, Option 130: MITEL IP PHONE (case sensitive), Option 132: (Long) <VLAN ID>, Option 133: (Long) 6. You also need either port based VLAN tagging on the switch or you will have to statically set the VLAN ID on the phone and PC.

[ralph]

Note:  The 5000 doesn't act as a DHCP server.

Ralph

[acejavelin]

DHCP options 125 or 128, 129, 130, 132, 133. Sonicwall should have IP Helper configuration under Network/IP Helper. Create the sub interfaces and connect the Parent interface to layer 2 switch (VLAN Trunk). Create IP Helper to forward from VLAN interface to the DHCP server IP. Option 125 is a string: id:ipphone.mitel.com;sw_tftp=<Server IP address>;call_srv=<Server IP address>;vlan=<VLAN ID>;l2p=1;mode=minet . Option 128: <Server IP address>,  Option 129: <Server IP address>, Option 130: MITEL IP PHONE (case sensitive), Option 132: (Long) <VLAN ID>, Option 133: (Long) 6. You also need either port based VLAN tagging on the switch or you will have to statically set the VLAN ID on the phone and PC.

Use Option 43!!! It is SOO MUCH EASIER, and the way the manual recommends, plus it is the only way if you have the older Inter-Tel IP phones (although a little trickery is needed to use one option for both phone types). Plus almost all Mitel phones will recognize it and use it, and most DHCP servers/routers have a way to do this, except basic SOHO routers.

Note that option 125 is NOT a dumb text string... it is an encapsulated option, using just an ASCII text string will fail.

Note:  The 5000 doesn't act as a DHCP server.

Ralph

Correct, currently that is... the rumor mill (ie. tech support) says this is coming, probably in the next major version release.

The easiest way to do DHCP for Mitel phones in a network with a 5000 that doesn't have a DHCP server capable of handing out the correct options is to purchase a used PC or older server that is Linux compliant (or the customer may have an old PC/server laying around, those old Windows Server 2000/2003 boxes work great), and install MSL but do not license it or register it with AMC, then you have gained two (possibly 3) very useful tools, a SMTP email relay server, a Mitel compatible DHCP server, and if needed it can be a router or inter-VLAN gateway as well. We typically use some 3-4 year old dual-core HP business class PC's from state surplus that we get for $40-$80, works like a champ! Or if the customer insist on a new unit, there are sub-$300 PCs that work well available from many vendors.