Mitel Forums - The Unofficial Source
Mitel Forums => MiVoice Office 250/Mitel 5000 => Topic started by: unclejemima on March 06, 2017, 05:34:11 PM
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We've got a Mitel 5000 aka Mivoice 250 now. We also have MiCollab server installed with teleworker.
This has always been an interesting challenge as our users have never really fell in love with the micollab app.
Recently in the app store found there is 2 apps. We've only been able to get the grey one to work, what is my understanding the old one.
(http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn123/cornflakejoe/mitel%20app_zpsutbmsafz.jpg) (http://s303.photobucket.com/user/cornflakejoe/media/mitel%20app_zpsutbmsafz.jpg.html)
Now upon further investigation, the second blue colored app appears to be a better, newer version and we attempted to connect to it. When you login to it, it asks for a auth code or to scan a QR code. We tried to rig the micollab server to send one out, but from what we can tell...this won't work with our 5000 (but will work with the astra 5000)
Here is a photo of the drop down showing the list of options. The mivoice 250 is not on the list...and I assume the 5000 is the new 5000? (damn mitel and using the same name for a newer system)
(http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn123/cornflakejoe/mitel%20micollab_zpsrata3enu.jpg) (http://s303.photobucket.com/user/cornflakejoe/media/mitel%20micollab_zpsrata3enu.jpg.html)
Long story. Does anyone have experience with either of the 2 apps, and is there a difference between them?
Is there any physical way to get mivoice 250 to work with this blue/white app?
Thanks!
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Unclejemima,
The only app that worked with the MiVO-250 was the older "grey/gray" icon mobile client.
The UCA on the latest MiCollab is no longer a supported application with the MiVO-250 as it is being replaced by the Mitel Phone Manager; I believe there is a special offer for those looking for an "upgrade" path. The remaining applications on the MiCollab are still supported though; NuPoint, MBG, AWVC.
Sorry,
TE
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What is the Mitel Phone Manager? Will that be avail with the miVO-250?
We're just using the softphone.
If we had a 3300, i'd imagine it would work fine?
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Sorry would you mind clairifing this more. We just upgraded our MiCollab and the uca still works...only we're stuck with the old app.
Are you saying it won't work at all or just limited to the grey app? Is the blue app much better?
Do you have anymore info on the upgrade path? Very curious and will take any advice I can.
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Sorry would you mind clairifing this more. We just upgraded our MiCollab and the uca still works...only we're stuck with the old app.
Are you saying it won't work at all or just limited to the grey app? Is the blue app much better?
Do you have anymore info on the upgrade path? Very curious and will take any advice I can.
There are documents on Mitel's site, the "classic" client works with the MiVO250, the "new gen" client does not, and the classic client is being depreciated... 7.3 is the last version that will work with the MiVO250 on the desktop, and 7.1~7.2 version that would work with the mobile client.
PB 20160177 talks about the mobile client, PB 20160159 talks about the legacy PC client.
I literally just had this conversation with Sales Engineering yesterday, as to the migration program this was in the email: The promotion to move from MiCollab Client to PhoneManager ended at the end of December 2016. There is currently no migration program or promotion to move to PhoneManager, although we have been told there will be another one.
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unclejemima,
The gray UCA Mobile Client is the only one that will work with the MiVO-250; refer to the documents that acejavelin attached to their post.
As for what is Phone Manager, now called MiVoice Office Application Suite as of yesterday with the new release, that is not a simple answer. It is similar to the MiCollab server in that it provided presence management with either a desktop or mobile client, but they are now combining it with the Customer Service Manager to provide even more functionality such as reporting.
For a better look at it go to this website and see for yourself. Phone Manager (http://www.mitel.com/products/collaboration-software/mitel-phone-manager)
Thanks,
TE
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What PBX's are meant to work with new gen client? Would our next option be the 3300? (what ever its called now I don't know)
Seems like the MiVO250 is becoming a legacy product?
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What PBX's are meant to work with new gen client? Would our next option be the 3300? (what ever its called now I don't know)
Seems like the MiVO250 is becoming a legacy product?
Not legacy, just a change in focus...
And yes, MiCollab Client is (and really always has been in my opinion) intended for the larger enterprise, like the MiVoice Business.
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Unclejemima,
The issue comes down to this, in my opinion. When Mitel bought out Inter-Tel they kept the 5000 and 3000 platforms and shelved the 7000. They also kept a couple of the applications such as the Audio Web Conference and Contact Center Suite. They then tried to shoehorn their existing products together with the Inter-Tel product lines. Since the platforms work completely differently you can imagine that the process was not an easy one. What they figured out was there were other companies that had products that were similar to theirs, such as Phone Manager by Xarios, that were specifically designed to work with the now MiVO-250. So they did the smart thing and worked out a deal with Xarios to combine the Customer Service Manager and a Call Recording server into the Phone Manager; now called the MiVoice Office Application Suite. This allows them to put out a better product offering than they previously had with the MiVO-250, but the downside is the discontinuation of certain MiCollab applications being supported as it is no longer necessary to put time and money into making it work with the MiVO-250. Hopefully that clears it up a little for you.
Thanks,
TE
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Thanks guys.
So if we wanted to move one step up from the mivo250 to something that would with with the micollab, i'm assuming the the 3300 would be the next jump?
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Thanks guys.
So if we wanted to move one step up from the mivo250 to something that would with with the micollab, i'm assuming the the 3300 would be the next jump?
Yes. But to be honest, going from a MiVO250 to a MiVB (MiVoice Business or 3300) is an upgrade for capacity, but it feels like a downgrade in features, especially to the user.
We don't even look at the MiVB unless it is around 150-200 or more phones per location, or has some other special need for the MiVB.
I have been working on the 3300 and 5000 for longer than I remember, since both were introduced. Although today my primary job focus is deployment and maintenance of MiVB systems and clusters... I hate them, although it is getting a better (slowly) it is still a cluster f*** of controllers, VM's, and servers, requiring going into this server to do that, that server to do that, this piece here, there, make a new COS, change this system option... Grrr... they are so frustrating sometimes. (I had a rough 3300 day, can you tell? lol)
I would rather deal with a network of MiVO systems with Phone Manager any day if I have a choice, from both the technician and user point of view.
All that said, the 3300 has some distinct features that are unmatched by the 5000 as well.
If they would just virtualize the MiVO it would be perfect...
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unclejemima,
Wow, I never heard of anyone wanting to change out a phone system because of one application, but if you like the desktop or mobile client that much then yes you would need to go to one of the other phone systems that Mitel supports with that MiCollab client. I am not saying that it would be an upgrade to the service you get from the MiVO-250, because most likely it won't be, but depending on which one you go to you might be able to reuse the phones.
By the way what part of the MiCollab client is driving this thought process?
Thanks,
TE
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Its a long story. I'm frankly annoyed tired of hearing the "well the 5000 doesn't but the 3300 does..." Like the 2nd display page on the 5320, a proper "hang up" button, etc. Seems like the 5000 has always got the short end of the stick...or Mitel forgot about it.
Its like the 5000/250 is what it is, and they are not going to change it.
I'm not really concerned about switching system...just wanted to know options. We were tossing between a 3300 and 5000 since day one. Pricing was similar, with the 3300 only slightly more expensive. Still wish we just did the 3300.
The thing that is driving all this is our local phone shop just had us pay our yearly upgrade (I think for even 2 years) for the MiCollab for our 250...what is, from what I get, discontinued/EOL for the MiVo250. So basically we just paid for an upgrade for something that can't be upgraded.
Is it just me, or is that kind of silly by the dealer to offer that?
The ONLY reason we have the MiCollab is because of the softphones for use by our warehouse staff and their iphones. They ONLY use it inside the building on the local wifi. We've got a few teleworker users but what a pain that is to reliably keep working.
The legacy app has, lets be honest, never been great... with a host of issues and lack of features that mitel would simply blame "on apple"
It works but I feel like the app could be so much better, and through the years the upgrades and the app has remained the same with only some minor bug fixes in the back end. No major changes.
Can the new micollab app "do more"? That's really what I was looking for. Are we missing out?
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unclejemima,
Fair enough and if you don't mind I will try to answer some of you concerns.
The 2nd display page on a 5320 was not necessary on the 5000/250 as it already has an alternate keymap function that does the same thing; so in essence they put in the 2nd display page to match what the 5000/250 could already do.
A proper "hangup" button on the 5000/250 like all phone systems is either the hook switch, when the handset is up, or the speaker button, when using the speaker. To the 3300 the Outgoing key is treated like a feature instead of function and therefore the Cancel key will cancel that feature. On the 5000/250 the Outgoing key is treated like a function and therefore the Cancel feature doesn't work with it.
I am not sure that the 5000/250 got the short end of the stick as it was developed by a completely different company (Inter-Tel) who Mitel bought out because their system was beating in them too many markets. Since then the 5000/250 has been getting upgrades just like the 3300, but since the two system work completely differently and are designed for different applications it wouldn't make sense to completely rewrite the 5000/250 from the ground up to make it work like the 3300. Are there some feature I would like to see on the 5000/250 that the 3300 can do; sure. Those feature however are mostly physical though, like redundant power supplies and T1/PRI failover. There is the concept of system failover that would be nice, but I don't think they would spend the money on that feature for the 5000/250 since most companies that purchase the 5000/250 don't request that feature.
The MiCollab still works with the 5000/250, but the MiCollab client formally UCA will no longer be supported, but the remaining features of the MiCollab will be supported for the 5000/250. Also to answer you question on whether you would get more features going to the new client the answer would be no as there are no major changes between the two so you aren't missing out on much. I am not sure what issues you are having with the MiCollab client on the 5000/250, but the only one I know of is an issue with the iPhone speaker function properly; everything else seems to work just as expected.
Personally if that is the only feature you are using on the MiCollab then I am not sure why your vendor didn't propose the Phone Manager swapout. It could be that they are not familiar with the product or they don't have anyone certified on it; that is something you would need to take up with them.
My suggestion though would be when it becomes time to swap out the 5000/250 then let them know you want to move over to the 3300 and they would probably be very happy to accommodate you. If the original price difference wasn't that far apart for you the first time the second time around it shouldn't be either; although that sounds odd to me.
Thanks,
TE
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The MiCollab still works with the 5000/250, but the MiCollab client formally UCA will no longer be supported, but the remaining features of the MiCollab will be supported for the 5000/250. Also to answer you question on whether you would get more features going to the new client the answer would be no as there are no major changes between the two so you aren't missing out on much. I am not sure what issues you are having with the MiCollab client on the 5000/250, but the only one I know of is an issue with the iPhone speaker function properly; everything else seems to work just as expected.
Thank you for the detailed reply.
As I'm still a NOOB with this phone stuff, can you help me understand the above statement?
Is the MiCollab Client the one that runs on your PC to show you who's phoning, etc? Or are you talking about the MiCollab Iphone App? (grey one)
Can the phone manager work as a standalone softphone? That all we want and all we us the MiCollab for. I looked at some screenshots for the Phone Manager and it didnt appear to be a softphone for iphone, more a availability, status and messaging app?
Our MiCollab (grey one) is very odd. If you don't open up the app every morning and usually once again during the day, the phone will not ring.
Most of the time the softphone (if you went into the app first thing in the AM before your shift) will ring at full volume if a call comes in...other times it will ring really quite, just enought that you can't hear it... until you swipe your phone on...then the ring will get full loud.
Other times, it won't ring at all, unless your phone is on and your in the app. As soon as you close the screen the phone won't ring.
And every day it does something different. These are dedicated phones with ONLY the micollab app and nothing else, and they have a different mood every day.
Overall it seems like a hokey temperamental occasionally working app made by someone in their basement. Its not me that's not impressed, I just feel like I let the staff down every time I try and trouble shoot the bugger phones...and there is nothing I can do but hope for a update or new version...and looks like that time will never come.
Oh, and as a softphone the absolutely tiny button you have to press to access the dial keypad is also silly. I wonder sometime if mitel uses what they make...or are they secretly still using Nortel phones and giving us the garbage ;-)
Now keep in mind this comes from a guy who has no life in the telecommuncations world. Just a tech who has to deal with angry users of the micollab softphone.
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unclejemima,
No problem and I wouldn't expect you to be knowledgeable about all of this as I am sure your job isn't installing and supporting Mitel equipment so no worries.
The MiCollab Client is actually what was formally known as UCA (Unified Communications Advanced) and it had a desktop client version and a mobile client version both with a softphone add-on. It seems that you were only using the mobile version with the softphone and probably not the presence management portion; although it is still there.
As for Phone Manager it has the same two options of a desktop client and a mobile client both with a softphone add-on and obviously the presence management as well. The UCA and Phone Manager applications work completely differently, but they do the same things. So as you have probably figured out Mitel is throwing its support behind Phone Manager for the 5000/250 and MiCollab Client for all the other systems.
It sounds as though the application and possibly the phones settings are not properly setup on the phones you are using. The presence management portion can have a big effect on it as well. As to what the real problem is I couldn't say without looking at them myself. Your best bet is to get your vendor tech support or engineer to look at it for you to figure out what is wrong.
Personally, if the phone system is doing everything you need it to do for the remainder of your staff then I would look into getting the MiCollab swapped out to Phone Manager. Phone Manager has a lot of nice new features as of version 5.0, and it looks as though they are going to put a lot more into it. The product actually belongs to a company called Xarios, but Mitel has also had them take over a few other applications such as Customer Service Manager and I believe Oaisys Recording as well, and they are integrating them into the Phone Manager; the latter one I may be wrong about though. My company has just started supporting the product and from what I can see it is going to be a great product to enhance the 5000/250 for all of our customers; I personally like it better than the MiCollab server, but that is just me. At this point I believe my company is only going to sell the MiCollab to 5000/250 customers if they want the AWVC (Audio Web Video Conference) portion; which was originally designed by Inter-Tel who made the 5000/250. There is also the Mitel Border Gateway (MBG) that we use it for but we don't call it a MiCollab at that point even though it is the same server; semantics really.
Hopefully that answered your questions,
TE
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Thanks Tech Electronics. Really appreciate your replies.
Does the Phone Manager have a Border Gateway so the softphone's can be used outside the office?
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unclejemima,
No the Phone Manager doesn't have a Border Gateway built into it. The Mitel Border Gateway should always be a separate server than an application server even if it is a MiCollab. The good thing is if you wanted a MBG you already have the server in the MiCollab so all you would need to do is get it licensed for it.
Also, you don't really need the Mitel Border Gateway with the Phone Manager and the 5000/250 except for another layer of security or to circumvent the Firewall/Router if it won't support SIP properly.
Thanks,
TE
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The simplest, cheapest and best answer to this issue.
Swap MiCollab for Mitel Phone Manager.
Phone Manager can be a Softphone on a PC, Android or IOS phone.
The new V5 Server will also do you reporting and Call Recording (Call recording is a it of a kludge though, go for a standalone if you are talking more then 8 trunks)
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Thanks guys.
Do you guys have anything official stating that mitel has discontinued or dropped support for the MiCollab and the Mivo250?
I tried to find the docs PB 20160177 & PB 20160159 but was unable to find them. I want to make sure when I talk to the mitel dealer that I'm well informed.
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unclejemima,
I am on vacation this week so I don't have access to my laptop with that information on it right now.
Your Mitel dealer should be well aware of the issue with the MiCollab Client portion of the MiCollab server.
Just keep in mind that the MiCollab server itself is still supported, but the MiCollab Client is no longer supported.
Thanks,
TE
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Thanks guys.
Do you guys have anything official stating that mitel has discontinued or dropped support for the MiCollab and the Mivo250?
I tried to find the docs PB 20160177 & PB 20160159 but was unable to find them. I want to make sure when I talk to the mitel dealer that I'm well informed.
Go to the 5th post in this thread (on page 1 of the thread) and they are attached to my post, you can download them there.
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Fantastic! Thank you!!!